• RichA
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Topic: The latest "mount any lens" camera

Olympus EP-1 and Voigtlander 58mm f1.4

Link to front shot:

http://www.pbase.com/andersonrm/image/1 … 3/original

http://www.pbase.com/andersonrm/image/114476571/original.jpg

Using manual lenses on it, not so great.
As I suspected, the LCD is not suited to this.  Its resolution is
somewhat low, and there is no sure focus position. You can only
ballpark it. There is (using the 58mm f1.4 Nokton) about 2mm of focus
movement where the LCD image does not change, but there is definitely
a difference to the lens and you would see it in the final image.
If the lens is a wide angle and it's set at a narrow aperture, this
probably won't matter because (depending on how close the subject you
are) the DOF should take care of any minor LCD-borne errors, but if
it's a fast lens, focus errors will be common.  So, if you had dreams
of putting Leica M glass on it, it won't be the greatest experience.
As for using the LCD to compose outside, it should be ok, except in
direct sunlight where like all LCDs, it will wash out.
For the time being, the Panasonic G1/GH1 are much better suited to
those two applications than the Olympus.  Perhaps if Olympus releases
a unit with an EVF, things will be different.

Last edited by RichA (2009-07-01 05:14:56)

CAMERAS: Panasonic G1-Olympus OM-4T-Pentax MX-Konica AR-TCx2-Olympus 35 RC Nikon N65. 
LENSES: Minolta-Konica-Takumar-Leica-Vivitar-Olympus-Voigtlander-Kiron-Tokina-Tamron-Yashica-Pentax-Nikon-Bushnell-Albinar-Rexatar-Sigma-Fujinon-Panasonic-Kinegon-Soligor, Promatic-William Optics-Underground-Hanimex.
http://www.pbase.com/andersonrm
  • From: NC, USA
  • Registered: 2007-07-27
  • Posts: 883

Re: The latest "mount any lens" camera

It seems absolutely crazy that they didn't go with one of the 920,000 dot LCDs. For a camera that ONLY uses the LCD, how can you have a such a worse screen than the latest Digital Rebel?

  • From: Swindon UK
  • Registered: 2006-10-03
  • Posts: 3,282

Re: The latest "mount any lens" camera

The lens is as big as the camera!
I imagine using MF lens on the camera would be great!
Some of the design ideas of the Olympus may be crazy, I think they are looking for a good profit rather than producing a good camera, it could backfire on them and be another nail in their coffin.

http://s159.photobucket.com/home/Rob-Leslie/allalbums

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  • Matt
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Re: The latest "mount any lens" camera

how is this camera a rangefinder?
it appears to lack a coupled rangefinder. does it superimpose two images on the LCD screen?

thanks


edit: i'm reading the dpreview review and i see it has a optional vt-17 viewfinder for the kit pancake.

Last edited by Matt (2009-07-02 02:17:59)

  • robertro
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Re: The latest "mount any lens" camera

It's not a rangefinder. It's not a dslr. It's a .... hmmm ....

I've debated whether the current generation of P&S cameras should be called something new, like "direct view", to honor the fact that you see the image that the lens sees, a huge improvement over rangefinders in many ways. In 35mm days, only a single-lens reflex could do that. P&S many of them are not, giving ample manual control. Perhaps they could be called "single-lens non-reflex"?

.                                                too many MF lenses, too little time___________
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  • Matt
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Re: The latest "mount any lens" camera

i'm not feeling this one at all.
an eyeball-to-viewfinder device seems to me inherently more stable (and controllable regarding composition).

Last edited by Matt (2009-07-02 02:33:52)

  • robertro
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Re: The latest "mount any lens" camera

I agree with you, I think that Oly goofed by not having an eye-level viewfinder. Though I am not yet ready to move to this type of camera, I would want one that has both types of viewfinder; I use both on my current dslrs.

My point was more that compact cameras have a level of direct viewing that was only attainable by slr's in the past; I was not referring to whether one looked directly at a screen on the back of the camera, or through a viewfinder.

Last edited by robertro (2009-07-02 11:35:55)

.                                                too many MF lenses, too little time___________
My Website: (in progress)
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  • RichA
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Re: The latest "mount any lens" camera

robertro wrote:

I agree with you, I think that Oly goofed by not having an eye-level viewfinder. Though I am not yet ready to move to this type of camera, I would want one that has both types of viewfinder; I use both on my current dslrs.

My point was more that compact cameras have a level of direct viewing that was only attainable by slr's in the past; I was not referring to whether one looked directly at a screen on the back of the camera, or through a viewfinder.

One good thing, apparently the viewfinder (rangefinder type) will be included with the 17mm f2.8 prime they are going to kit with the camera.
Better than paying another $150 like with the Sigma DP-1 or the Panasonic LX-3 unit.

CAMERAS: Panasonic G1-Olympus OM-4T-Pentax MX-Konica AR-TCx2-Olympus 35 RC Nikon N65. 
LENSES: Minolta-Konica-Takumar-Leica-Vivitar-Olympus-Voigtlander-Kiron-Tokina-Tamron-Yashica-Pentax-Nikon-Bushnell-Albinar-Rexatar-Sigma-Fujinon-Panasonic-Kinegon-Soligor, Promatic-William Optics-Underground-Hanimex.
http://www.pbase.com/andersonrm
  • From: Sweden
  • Registered: 2007-07-16
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Re: The latest "mount any lens" camera

RichA wrote:

One good thing, apparently the viewfinder (rangefinder type) will be included with the 17mm f2.8 prime they are going to kit with the camera.
Better than paying another $150 like with the Sigma DP-1 or the Panasonic LX-3 unit.

If I'm not completely misinformed (again), that is an optical viewfinder which only works well with 17 mm lenses. If they had sold accessory EVF-type viewfinders, I would probably have ordered an E-P1 instead of a G1.
With an EVF on this kind of camera, you see the "cropped image" as seen by the sensor, and can use it to focus your lenses.

/Erik

Blunderstein's Website

  • From: Wordsley West Midlands
  • Registered: 2009-04-28
  • Posts: 6

Re: The latest "mount any lens" camera

I think in just going for the retro look and sticking with the screen only concept Olympus have completely misjudged the enthusiast/semi pro market that the price indicates this is aimed at.It will end up as jewellery for those with more money than sense

CaptainPenguin's Website

  • From: Swindon UK
  • Registered: 2006-10-03
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Re: The latest "mount any lens" camera

CaptainPenguin wrote:

I think in just going for the retro look and sticking with the screen only concept Olympus have completely misjudged the enthusiast/semi pro market that the price indicates this is aimed at.It will end up as jewellery for those with more money than sense

My thoughts are the same. I just can't see the point of it or a use for it. It just looks nice.

http://s159.photobucket.com/home/Rob-Leslie/allalbums

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  • From: USA
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Re: The latest "mount any lens" camera

This camera is not an SLR.  Its strengths are compactness and retro-styling.

For us manual lens users, I think it's better to wait for the next model which will have EVF.

Follow the latest development at this rather goofy smile but quite consolidated source:

http://43rumors.com

Cheers, Will.

shadowfox's Website

  • RichA
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Re: The latest "mount any lens" camera

shadowfox wrote:

This camera is not an SLR.  Its strengths are compactness and retro-styling.

For us manual lens users, I think it's better to wait for the next model which will have EVF.

Follow the latest development at this rather goofy smile but quite consolidated source:

http://43rumors.com

Honestly, if I was in the market for a compact camera, I'd buy a Panasonic LX3.  The Olympus is not as good (all things considered) as the Panasonic G1/GH1 if a DSLR-like performance is what you are after.  Focus speed or lack of it is a major issue with that camera, the EP-1.  That, and no viewfinder.

CAMERAS: Panasonic G1-Olympus OM-4T-Pentax MX-Konica AR-TCx2-Olympus 35 RC Nikon N65. 
LENSES: Minolta-Konica-Takumar-Leica-Vivitar-Olympus-Voigtlander-Kiron-Tokina-Tamron-Yashica-Pentax-Nikon-Bushnell-Albinar-Rexatar-Sigma-Fujinon-Panasonic-Kinegon-Soligor, Promatic-William Optics-Underground-Hanimex.
http://www.pbase.com/andersonrm
  • From: Swindon UK
  • Registered: 2006-10-03
  • Posts: 3,282

Re: The latest "mount any lens" camera

RichA wrote:
shadowfox wrote:

This camera is not an SLR.  Its strengths are compactness and retro-styling.

For us manual lens users, I think it's better to wait for the next model which will have EVF.

Follow the latest development at this rather goofy smile but quite consolidated source:

http://43rumors.com

Honestly, if I was in the market for a compact camera, I'd buy a Panasonic LX3.  The Olympus is not as good (all things considered) as the Panasonic G1/GH1 if a DSLR-like performance is what you are after.  Focus speed or lack of it is a major issue with that camera, the EP-1.  That, and no viewfinder.

I agree.  If I want 'Compactness' I would go for the LX3 or my GRD2 If I want more general features I would go with a G10, if I want a DSLR I would buy a DSLR.
I would NEVER buy a camera for its 'Styling'
As for it ability to take odd lenses I am yet to see good results and lets face it those big lenses just look silly on the camera. Would anybody do a photoshot of 50-100 shots (With normal action, hand holding etc) using the Oly and a MF lens hanging on it!
Could I use Lens Baby on it !!!

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  • From: NC, USA
  • Registered: 2007-07-27
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Re: The latest "mount any lens" camera

Seems like one good use would be street photography with CCTV/RF fast wides.

  • RichA
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Re: The latest "mount any lens" camera

Blunderstein wrote:
RichA wrote:

One good thing, apparently the viewfinder (rangefinder type) will be included with the 17mm f2.8 prime they are going to kit with the camera.
Better than paying another $150 like with the Sigma DP-1 or the Panasonic LX-3 unit.

If I'm not completely misinformed (again), that is an optical viewfinder which only works well with 17 mm lenses. If they had sold accessory EVF-type viewfinders, I would probably have ordered an E-P1 instead of a G1.
With an EVF on this kind of camera, you see the "cropped image" as seen by the sensor, and can use it to focus your lenses.

/Erik

They could have supplied a zoom viewfinder for the hotshoe for the zoom kit lens, but it would cost a fair bit I think.
I still think the G1 is a better camera, focus speed being another good reason to get it.

CAMERAS: Panasonic G1-Olympus OM-4T-Pentax MX-Konica AR-TCx2-Olympus 35 RC Nikon N65. 
LENSES: Minolta-Konica-Takumar-Leica-Vivitar-Olympus-Voigtlander-Kiron-Tokina-Tamron-Yashica-Pentax-Nikon-Bushnell-Albinar-Rexatar-Sigma-Fujinon-Panasonic-Kinegon-Soligor, Promatic-William Optics-Underground-Hanimex.
http://www.pbase.com/andersonrm
  • RichA
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Re: The latest "mount any lens" camera

awldune wrote:

Seems like one good use would be street photography with CCTV/RF fast wides.

Not much fun focusing on a low-rez LCD with fast lenses.  If you stop the lens down to f8 and just leave it, it might work better in good light, anyway.

CAMERAS: Panasonic G1-Olympus OM-4T-Pentax MX-Konica AR-TCx2-Olympus 35 RC Nikon N65. 
LENSES: Minolta-Konica-Takumar-Leica-Vivitar-Olympus-Voigtlander-Kiron-Tokina-Tamron-Yashica-Pentax-Nikon-Bushnell-Albinar-Rexatar-Sigma-Fujinon-Panasonic-Kinegon-Soligor, Promatic-William Optics-Underground-Hanimex.
http://www.pbase.com/andersonrm
  • From: USA
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  • Posts: 1,564

Re: The latest "mount any lens" camera

Rob Leslie wrote:
RichA wrote:
shadowfox wrote:

This camera is not an SLR.  Its strengths are compactness and retro-styling.

For us manual lens users, I think it's better to wait for the next model which will have EVF.

Follow the latest development at this rather goofy smile but quite consolidated source:

http://43rumors.com

Honestly, if I was in the market for a compact camera, I'd buy a Panasonic LX3.  The Olympus is not as good (all things considered) as the Panasonic G1/GH1 if a DSLR-like performance is what you are after.  Focus speed or lack of it is a major issue with that camera, the EP-1.  That, and no viewfinder.

I agree.  If I want 'Compactness' I would go for the LX3 or my GRD2 If I want more general features I would go with a G10, if I want a DSLR I would buy a DSLR.
I would NEVER buy a camera for its 'Styling'

Now would I buy a camera just because of the styling.  But the EP-1's sensor is magnitudes larger than that of the LX3.  And that makes a different of what kind of picture you're able to create.  To me, that makes it a distinctive camera than the LX3.

Having said that, I'm going to repeat what I said before, EP-1 is *not* an SLR in usage or functionality, but it *is* par with any DSLR in terms of image-producing capability.  These are what makes it unique.

Cheers, Will.

shadowfox's Website

  • RichA
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Re: The latest "mount any lens" camera

There is a difference between shots taken with the LX3 and G1, no doubt.  But it's most evident at higher ISO's, 400 and up.  Here are two crops from both cameras:

G1 100 ISO:

http://www.pbase.com/andersonrm/image/114691699/original.jpg

LX3 100 ISO:

http://www.pbase.com/andersonrm/image/114691700/original.jpg

CAMERAS: Panasonic G1-Olympus OM-4T-Pentax MX-Konica AR-TCx2-Olympus 35 RC Nikon N65. 
LENSES: Minolta-Konica-Takumar-Leica-Vivitar-Olympus-Voigtlander-Kiron-Tokina-Tamron-Yashica-Pentax-Nikon-Bushnell-Albinar-Rexatar-Sigma-Fujinon-Panasonic-Kinegon-Soligor, Promatic-William Optics-Underground-Hanimex.
http://www.pbase.com/andersonrm
  • From: USA
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Re: The latest "mount any lens" camera

RichA wrote:

There is a difference between shots taken with the LX3 and G1, no doubt.  But it's most evident at higher ISO's, 400 and up.  Here are two crops from both cameras:

G1 100 ISO:

http://www.pbase.com/andersonrm/image/1 … iginal.jpg

LX3 100 ISO:

http://www.pbase.com/andersonrm/image/1 … iginal.jpg

No doubt, for that kind of pictures (where DoF rendering is not an issue), we're talking about pixel peeping differences.  Which was not what I meant.

I was talking about depth of field control.  When you take portraits and you want the background to blur smoothly.  LX3 cannot give me as shallow DoF as the G1 or other 4/3rd-sized sensor (or bigger) can.

And that may not be an important distinction to you, but it is to me and I'm sure many others.

Cheers, Will.

shadowfox's Website

  • From: Victoria BC
  • Registered: 2008-11-26
  • Posts: 76

Re: The latest "mount any lens" camera

I got one yesterday.  It handles like a P&S and it's got some stupid features that are offensive to me (like slide-show display with five built in soundtracks to choose from - ugh! wink).  But it gives the output of a decent DSLR and it handles well enough once you get the hang of it.  Even the 14-42 kit lens is pretty decent; not mind-numbingly excellent by any means, but no slouch either.   Autofocus is slow, just like a crummy P&S.

I haven't gotten an adapter for MF lenses yet; I'm going to do that asap though, at least once I figure out which lenses I'd most like to put on here.

It works for me, in short.  I don't mind adapting to the point-n-shootey interface in order to get image quality this decent in such a compact package.  It sort of sits in the uncomfortable netherworld between an absolute beginner's camera and a toy for a seasoned photographer though.  I will say that its relatively easy to control.  The only thing I really wish it had was a simple display of aperture, ISO and shutter speed, and nothing else cluttering up the view screen.  I hate all the superimposed icons of the info display (I shoot raw and deal with white balance and crap later, or I will once photoshop introduces E-P1 raw support which I expect won't take long), but I like to see what shutter speed I'm using (usually shoot aperture priority mode) so I don't like just using the blank (image only) view.

Last edited by walter23 (2009-07-18 04:43:36)

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  • Registered: 2009-06-28
  • Posts: 7

Re: The latest "mount any lens" camera

Live view @ 6 or 4 effective frames per second will never work well for focusing, and besides, I'm not interested in visualizing the world through a camera finder that looks like a really cheap saturday morning cartoon seen over a 56K modem.  And what's the point of being able to mount other lenses when a 'normal' angle of view is given by a 20 or 24 mm?  Who makes an 8 or 10 mm wide angle, which would be wide enough to successfully zone focus?  Oh, yeah, Arri/Zeiss have an 8mm/2.8 for about $10K.  Maybe Olympus will, but I think it's going to be one of the other camera companies that finally makes a controllable HQ digi compact.  Mr. Maitani may be a little depressed right now.

  • RichA
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Re: The latest "mount any lens" camera

pluton wrote:

Live view @ 6 or 4 effective frames per second will never work well for focusing, and besides, I'm not interested in visualizing the world through a camera finder that looks like a really cheap saturday morning cartoon seen over a 56K modem.  And what's the point of being able to mount other lenses when a 'normal' angle of view is given by a 20 or 24 mm?  Who makes an 8 or 10 mm wide angle, which would be wide enough to successfully zone focus?  Oh, yeah, Arri/Zeiss have an 8mm/2.8 for about $10K.  Maybe Olympus will, but I think it's going to be one of the other camera companies that finally makes a controllable HQ digi compact.  Mr. Maitani may be a little depressed right now.

You really have no practical experience with that camera, do you?

CAMERAS: Panasonic G1-Olympus OM-4T-Pentax MX-Konica AR-TCx2-Olympus 35 RC Nikon N65. 
LENSES: Minolta-Konica-Takumar-Leica-Vivitar-Olympus-Voigtlander-Kiron-Tokina-Tamron-Yashica-Pentax-Nikon-Bushnell-Albinar-Rexatar-Sigma-Fujinon-Panasonic-Kinegon-Soligor, Promatic-William Optics-Underground-Hanimex.
http://www.pbase.com/andersonrm
  • Registered: 2007-10-31
  • Posts: 50

Re: The latest "mount any lens" camera

RichA wrote:
pluton wrote:

Live view @ 6 or 4 effective frames per second will never work well for focusing, and besides, I'm not interested in visualizing the world through a camera finder that looks like a really cheap saturday morning cartoon seen over a 56K modem.  And what's the point of being able to mount other lenses when a 'normal' angle of view is given by a 20 or 24 mm?  Who makes an 8 or 10 mm wide angle, which would be wide enough to successfully zone focus?  Oh, yeah, Arri/Zeiss have an 8mm/2.8 for about $10K.  Maybe Olympus will, but I think it's going to be one of the other camera companies that finally makes a controllable HQ digi compact.  Mr. Maitani may be a little depressed right now.


You really have no practical experience with that camera, do you?


Ha ha.

I always enjoyed this forum because most posters are very knowledgeable and have great experience with esoteric equipment.

Now it looks more like the doofus "born yesterday, know nothing" crowd is starting to log on in greater numbers. POTN and DPreview are already dumbed down to the lowest common denominator of people who make silly remarks without ever having tried the equipment, or who parrot what they read online. I hope this forum stays "smart".

  • From: Swindon UK
  • Registered: 2006-10-03
  • Posts: 3,282

Re: The latest "mount any lens" camera

How Very Rude.
What a great way to welcome new members
Do we really want this forum as a little private club for a few who all think alike?
I for one would like to see many 'Know nothing' new members joining in, some people get fed up of just hearing from equipment 'Experts'
Pluton's opinion is valid, I will join in and class myself as a Know nothing Who Has Handled the camera and agree with him.

http://s159.photobucket.com/home/Rob-Leslie/allalbums

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